Another top sheet repair query: close encounter with a snowboarder.

[SlideWright]

A guy was skiing today in our fresh snow and crud with the first 6 or 8” of his topsheet flapping. I suggested that he might cut it clean across thinking it wouldn’t tear off and get lost. Too stoked to care, he basically said, ‘Naw I’m gonna let it rip off!”

 

[DebbieSue]

Thanks for the expert advice @Doug Briggs and @Dwight
So, here's before and after of my debut top sheet repair.
Before:

`

After:

The blue is paper left behind is from the tape dam, and yes I failed to fill a little bit at the edge where the tape dam must have prevented access.
Here's a pic of the tape dam, with the ski and epoxy having been warmed up . . .

Defect filled and cured.

Tape dam off. Time to wield that 12" typical mill bastard file.

Part way through the finishing process with files of various sorts including a choice tool from DHs lockpicking files . . . don't ask.
Next time, I will only use tape parallel to the edges so I don't get "sidewalls" on my patch. I tried to smooth them after this pic.

And again, the finished product. I will fill that remaining defect furthest from the sidewall when I get back from Quebec.
Pas mal, eh?

 

[Doug Briggs]

Thanks for the expert advice @Doug Briggs and @Dwight
So, here's before and after of my debut top sheet repair.
Before
View attachment 230311 `
After View attachment 230313

View attachment 230304

The blue is paper left behind is from the tape dam, and yes I failed to fill a little bit at the edge where the tape dam must have prevented access.
Here's a pic of the tape dam, with the ski and epoxy having been warmed up . . .
View attachment 230305
Defect filled and cured.
View attachment 230306
Tape dam off. Time to wield that 12" typical mill bastard file.
View attachment 230308
Part way through the finishing process with files of various sorts including a choice tool from DHs lockpicking files . . . don't ask.
Next time, I will only use tape parallel to the edges so I don't get "sidewalls" on my patch. I tried to smooth them after this pic.
View attachment 230309
And again, the finished product. I will fill that remaining defect furthest from the sidewall when I get back from Quebec.
Pas mal, eh?
View attachment 230310

Nice work. You were generous with the epoxy which is good. You can always put a skosh of epoxy in the gaps and file it down again. That's the beauty of epoxy; it adheres to most everything including itself.

I use a Panser file for most of the work I do on repairs. It is an aggressive file that takes down the epoxy pretty quickly. It also can leave a very nice smooth surface.

With practice you can get the repair flush with the sidewall which aids in providing clearance for edge sharpening in the future. Notice how in this image, the file fits into the 'notch' that is formed by the sidewall and the plastic above the edge. That let's the file match the plane of the sidewall. With a rounded top edge, don't hesitate to tip the file and form the epoxy into the shape of the rest of the top edge.

 

[dovski]

realize that I am late to this thread, but thought I would share that I have been using marine grade epoxy putty to do top sheet repairs. What's nice about this stuff is that it is easy to mold and shape. It takes 25 min to cure during which time you can sculpt it to fit the contour of your ski. It dries in an off white color that you can stain with a paint pen or sharpie - I use both on my son' skis to blend in with the top sheet color pattern. My only mistake was to over sand it once it dried as before that everything was smooth and seem less, but I had to get a little too fancy and wanted a rough finish to match the top sheet. The good news is once fully cured this repair was bullet proof. Personally I found working with the putty much easier than regular epoxy as you just mix it together kneed it and then fit it into the gap you want to fill, not taping or filing needed as you can shape by hand before it fully cures. Wearing disposable gloves is recommended.

 

[oldschoolskier]

There are some very specific epoxies for doing ski repairs, some flexible some for base to everything else adhesive. Sold in small packets.

Sorry don't remember the source(s).

Its also the reason I love Race skis (metal too sheet takes more abuse before cosmetic damage becomes risk of potential structural damage).

Good metal race poles also can be used as boarder repellent (AKA porcupine technique) as boarders religiously avoid self impalement it's amazing how much control they actually can have when motivated.

 

[SlideWright]

Nice job @DebbieSue!

IIRC, @Doug Briggs, the panzer/radial/body file evolved for doing car body work. It’s a very versatile file for lots of tasks.

Interesting @dovski. Nice work. I picked up some of that epoxy recently for another project.

Hardman Bubble packs come in many flavors. Per an old SVST epoxy chart, the flexible, D50 shore strength Urethane was their recommendation for sidewall & topsheet repairs:

 

[DebbieSue]

So . . . some follow-up. The top sheet repair held up well for 2 days of skiing at the NEG. I was a little worried about the "generous" epoxy. I was careful to tape over the metal edge, did not think to concern my self with the contour of the sidewall, which now has a slight bulge. I decided to keep that ski on my right foot, so the patch would be on my outside edge where any flaw would be less critical. Fortunately, I don't drive high edge angles, so I did not "patch out." Still not sure if I'm gonna buy me a Panzer file . . . I don't like gizmos. On the other hand, my DH supports buying tools named after tanks.

Swix Panzer Body File

Non chromed panzer file.

www.starthaus.com

 

[James]

Swix appears to have spelled it wrong.
Usually ‘panzar’ or ‘pansar’
Also known as a ‘body file’ for bondo in auto body shops.

It’s as much a gizmo as a screwdriver is, but you don’t “need” one. Just use sandpaper.

 

[SlideWright]

Swix appears to have spelled it wrong.
Usually ‘panzar’ or ‘pansar’
Also known as a ‘body file’ for bondo in auto body shops.

It’s as much a gizmo as a screwdriver is, but you don’t “need” one. Just use sandpaper.

Since three versions are commonly used, I've been uncertain for eons on the proper spelling, but I 'think' it is 'pansar' file (or radial or body file) and have not found a source for the file's name origin yet. I did, however, find this bad boy for 'vintage Swedis Pansar files':

 

[jt10000]

Fortunately, I don't drive high edge angles, so I did not "patch out."

 

[Doug Briggs]

Swix appears to have spelled it wrong.
Usually ‘panzar’ or ‘pansar’
Also known as a ‘body file’ for bondo in auto body shops.

It’s as much a gizmo as a screwdriver is, but you don’t “need” one. Just use sandpaper.

No, they don't need one. A panzar/pansar/panzer will however remove material a lot faster and with a better likelihood of being flat and smooth than sandpaper.

 

[James]

No, they don't need one. A panzar/pansar/panzer will however remove material a lot faster and with a better likelihood of being flat and smooth than sandpaper.

The patch on her ski is 1/2 the size of a postage stamp.

 

[cantunamunch]

Since three versions are commonly used, I've been uncertain for eons on the proper spelling, but I 'think' it is 'pansar' file (or radial or body file) and have not found a source for the file's name origin yet.

If Wiktionary is right about the ultimate origin being Latin pantex , it might have to do with the tooth shape being curved like a beer gut. Seems as likely as anything else I've seen.

pansar - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

As to spelling, are we culturally appropriating from Swedish, German or Italian today?

 

[Swiss Toni]

I think ‘Pansar’ is a trade name for the milled tooth files used by auto body repair shops, they were originally designed for filing auto body solder. This type of file has teeth that are milled rather than chisel cut as with conventional files. They are available with straight cut or curved teeth and with or without tangs. A major manufacturer is Pascal La Lime Fraiseuse of France http://amenagement-vehicule-utilitaire.com/limesfraiseuses/catalogue-en.html

A laminate file might be better than a ‘Pansar’ file for filing top sheet edges as they are designed for filing the edges of plastic laminates https://www.practicalprods.com/onlinecatalog/plasti-cut-files/

If you just want to remove a bit of excess epoxy any file will do, as will sandpaper.

 

[SlideWright]

If Wiktionary is right about the ultimate origin being Latin pantex , it might have to do with the tooth shape being curved like a beer gut. Seems as likely as anything else I've seen.

pansar - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

As to spelling, are we culturally appropriating from Swedish, German or Italian today?

...or ye olde Swedish, eh?

 

[SlideWright]

I think ‘Pansar’ is a trade name for the milled tooth files used by auto body repair shops, they were originally designed for filing auto body solder. This type of file has teeth that are milled rather than chisel cut as with conventional files. They are available with straight cut or curved teeth and with or without tangs. A major manufacturer is Pascal La Lime Fraiseuse of France http://amenagement-vehicule-utilitaire.com/limesfraiseuses/catalogue-en.html

A laminate file might be better than a ‘Pansar’ file for filing top sheet edges as they are designed for filing the edges of plastic laminates https://www.practicalprods.com/onlinecatalog/plasti-cut-files/

If you just want to remove a bit of excess epoxy any file will do, as will sandpaper.

FWIW, laminate file aka Diamond Macro Cut by one mfgr:

 

[James]

I think ‘Pansar’ is a trade name for the milled tooth files used by auto body repair shops, they were originally designed for filing auto body solder. This type of file has teeth that are milled rather than chisel cut as with conventional files. They are available with straight cut or curved teeth and with or without tangs. A major manufacturer is Pascal La Lime Fraiseuse of France http://amenagement-vehicule-utilitaire.com/limesfraiseuses/catalogue-en.html

A laminate file might be better than a ‘Pansar’ file for filing top sheet edges as they are designed for filing the edges of plastic laminates https://www.practicalprods.com/onlinecatalog/plasti-cut-files/

If you just want to remove a bit of excess epoxy any file will do, as will sandpaper.

Nice, never heard of it.
I tend to go for a like 13tpcm chrome file once I’ve roughed with the pansar, though I don’t always use the pansar. I also use the file for touch ups. Sandpaper is nice for finishing so your skis don’t rip your jacket or hand.

For someone with little experience of files, using a pansar on a sidewall/topsheet edge isn’t the easiest thing and is likely to be frustrating.

 

[DebbieSue]

If Wiktionary is right about the ultimate origin being Latin pantex , it might have to do with the tooth shape being curved like a beer gut. Seems as likely as anything else I've seen.

pansar - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

As to spelling, are we culturally appropriating from Swedish, German or Italian today?

Apparently “panzer” is German for armor, as in Panzerkampfwagen I. Do you think they might have been developed to smooth the solder on tanks and then used for automobiles?

 

[DebbieSue]

The patch on her ski is 1/2 the size of a postage stamp.

Well, excuuuuse me. The patch is bigger than a postage stamp!

 

[cantunamunch]

Apparently “panzer” is German for armor, as in Panzerkampfwagen I. Do you think they might have been developed to smooth the solder on tanks and then used for automobiles?

There is also the notion that they took the word Panzer from the Italian for belly armor. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/panciera#Italian

I mean they did take 'Kaiser' from the proper pronunciation of 'Caesar'