When/where to carry bear spray?

[SBrown]

I've seen bears in CO, but never while hiking. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but it's not high on the list. As people have said, black bears are way way way different than grizzlies.

Some hiker over here was trampled and seriously injured by a cow last year around this time! And of course moose are the real scary ones IMO.

I did get chased by some livestock guardian dogs last week while on a motorcycle in the Flattops. Those things are probably more worrisome than bears if you come across a herd of sheep while hiking; not sure about that in Summit, but farther west, there is quite a bit of grazing on public lands. So I was thinking about putting my bear spray on my bicycle but hadn't really looked into it too much yet. Getting pulled down by LGDs isn't on my bucket list. They didn't get super close last week, but I was surprised how long they followed (and how aggressive; they split up to cut us off, luckily the road curved the other way).

 

[dbostedo]

I did get chased by some livestock guardian dogs last week while on a motorcycle in the Flattops. Those things are probably more worrisome than bears if you come across a herd of sheep while hiking; not sure about that in Summit, but farther west, there is quite a bit of grazing on public lands. So I was thinking about putting my bear spray on my bicycle but hadn't really looked into it too much yet. Getting pulled down by LGDs isn't on my bucket list. They didn't get super close last week, but I was surprised how long they followed (and how aggressive; they split up to cut us off, luckily the road curved the other way).

Maybe they thought you were part of the herd, and we're just trying to get around in front of you to herd you back into the group?

Glad that didn't go some other way... that is a weird thing. I've hiked through farms and a bunch of sheep in New Zealand (public hiking routes often go through farms), and I guess they don't have dog use/issues there. I wouldn't have thought of that potentially being a problem.

 

[scott43]

Bears.. pfffft... here's what you really need to be worried about!!!

Number of people who died by becoming tangled in their bedsheets correlates with Total revenue generated by skiing facilities (US)

Can you come up with a causal mechanism?

www.tylervigen.com

 

[DanoT]

Same with black bears. I guided fly fishing out of a lodge in Northern Ontario that also had a bear hunting program over bait (legal there). The guys who baited the stands were getting false charged all the time. They also carried 870 riot guns. However they never shot a bear - because false charging was common, and those bears equated to inventory. They did not want to take one out of inventory unless absolutely necessary.

^^^This reminded me of a co-worker that along with his buddies, they run cougar hounds. He told be that years ago they stopped shooting the cougars because they realized that eventually there would be no cougars to hunt. So they have the hounds chase and tree a cougar and when they catch up to the hounds and cougar, the guys just observe and take photos. They have tracking collars for the hounds because once on a sent the dogs will literally run for days chasing down a cougar and the "hunter' cannot keep up and are fearful of loosing the dog. Makes sense to preserve their sport.

 

[SBrown]

Maybe they thought you were part of the herd, and we're just trying to get around in front of you to herd you back into the group?

Glad that didn't go some other way... that is a weird thing. I've hiked through farms and a bunch of sheep in New Zealand (public hiking routes often go through farms), and I guess they don't have dog use/issues there. I wouldn't have thought of that potentially being a problem.

Except they aren't herders, they are protectors, and they are mean when they are protecting!

This is pretty good info, since we are on the subject. I have also heard to give the command "Go back to your sheep!" but I don't know if that is really true, and honestly most of the shepherds speak to them in Spanish or something anyway?

 

[Daniel]

Maybe they thought you were part of the herd, and we're just trying to get around in front of you to herd you back into the group?

Glad that didn't go some other way... that is a weird thing. I've hiked through farms and a bunch of sheep in New Zealand (public hiking routes often go through farms), and I guess they don't have dog use/issues there. I wouldn't have thought of that potentially being a problem.

I've done the same but the breeds of dogs found among sheep in NZ are herding breeds. There are no land predators in NZ preying on the herds save for the very rare feral dog. In the North American west and in Europe the breeds of dogs found among sheep are tasked with guarding the sheep and directly encountering land predators, of which there are many. Have had numerous encounters on both continents while on foot, mountain bike, and dirt bike. The most common sheep guardian breed I've seen in UT is the Great Pyrenees and there are typically several present with each herd. Have never felt overly threatened by one but, once aware of your presence, they immediately place themselves between the herd and your location and track your every movement with enough aggression to make it clear you need to move on. Easy to leave behind on a dirt bike but they will follow you for quite some distance if taking on a long, rough, difficult climb on a mountain bike. I have felt semi-threatened by guardian dogs in France, Italy, and Switzerland when on foot in proximity to sheep herds in the Alps, Pyrenees, the island of Corsica, etc. but am not sure of the breeds I encountered.

Here's a news story about a wolverine ravaging a sheep herd in UT this past spring:

Caught killing sheep in Utah, a wolverine is now the first roaming the state wearing a GPS collar

Last year, wolverines were sighted at least four times in Utah.

www.sltrib.com

 

[SBrown]

I've done the same but the breeds of dogs found among sheep in NZ are herding breeds. There are no land predators in NZ preying on the herds save for the very rare feral dog.

That was the same in Iceland; the largest predator is the arctic fox, so they can just graze and roam freely.

 

[Aeolian]

That was the same in Iceland; the largest predator is the arctic fox, so they can just graze and roam freely.

There is the occasional polar bear....

But mostly an ignorable statistical outlier. And they do not last long for obvious reasons.

 

[martyg]

Good to know...I didn't know black bears tended to do the same. Sounds like the people in that program had enough knowledge to decipher between an actual threat and a perceived one from a bear. I think that's the key...death of the bear should only happen if absolutely necessary.

I've been thinking about this.... I wonder if it is a learned behavior for this population? The bears know that a dude with a bucket of fish heads and molasses visits every few days at a certain time? That would be interesting to dig into.

 

[martyg]

If you want to get a bit of data driven bear research, as well as be entertained, this is very worth the watch.

These researchers were crawling into bear dens, pulling cubs, and tagged (if I remember correctly) 304 bears over two years. The cute factor with the cubs is worth the watch alone.

One of the team was the most successful bear hunter in the state, who was recruited by F&G. This study has produced well over a dozen peer reviewed scientific papers that debunks what we thought we knew about black bears.

 

[martyg]

This should be a link from PBS to watch for free.

 

[wooglin]

If you want to get a bit of data driven bear research, as well as be entertained, this is very worth the watch.

These researchers were crawling into bear dens, pulling cubs, and tagged (if I remember correctly) 304 bears over two years. The cute factor with the cubs is worth the watch alone.

One of the team was the most successful bear hunter in the state, who was recruited by F&G. This study has produced well over a dozen peer reviewed scientific papers that debunks what we thought we knew about black bears.


View attachment 213543

If its cute cubs you want, follow the Kilham Bear Center on insta.

Kilham Bear Center – Preserving the Black Bear Population

kilhambearcenter.org

 

[scott43]

Bears.. pfffft... here's what you really need to be worried about!!!

Number of people who died by becoming tangled in their bedsheets correlates with Total revenue generated by skiing facilities (US)

Can you come up with a causal mechanism?

www.tylervigen.com

View attachment 213522

I wanna know if slugs or shot are better against the covers...

 

[mdf]

To back that up... Anecdotally the people who respond to bear incidences in Pitkin County (Aspen) have reported that when a bear breaks into a residence, they leave the cheap ice cream in the freezer untouched, but devour the super premium brands. Super smart, super cool, and they have exquisite taste in ice cream!

What do you expect? They are Aspen bears!

 

[François Pugh]

I live in what we call Northern Ontario. Lot's of black bears.
I would just like to point out that a black bear will kill you dead. Dead is dead. There is no such thing as being deader if you are killed by a grizzly bear.
I have heard more than one account of predatory male black bears attacking, being repelled with bear spray, re-stalking and attacking again, and again. One poor fellow barely made it back to his truck and out after he exhausted his bear spray. Good Idea to have a back up firearm if it is permitted and you can use it. If you can't use it, or don't have the skill and temperament to use it properly, then don't have it on you. I know my former friend, may he rest in peace, was very glad he had the side arm with him. How many people didn't make it back to their truck and nobody knows where they are?

Also like to point out, that if I were camping in Polar bear country, I would have something with more stopping power, like a good rifle. A black bear hunting you is rare, they are omnivores. A polar bear is a carnivore.

 

[Wendy]

As a geology major while in college, I had to take a field camp course. I investigated one in Alaska, then decided against it after learning one of the requirements was to carry a shotgun as protection against grizzlies.

Not against using firearms as protection when absolutely necessary, but I knew that my disposition wouldn't fit being in a long, challenging field course for a college grade, AND having to worry about operating a firearm. But I wouldn't venture into some of those areas up there without being accompanied by somebody who was armed and trained.

I did go to field camp in Montana, and a lot of that time spent in the field was alone in the Bitterroots. I did not carry bear spray (I didn't even know it was a thing back then). But back at our base camp, we were frequented by a brown bear who liked to prowl around outside the bathhouse.

 

[scott43]

You don't do any work in polar bear country without a reliable, large calibre long gun.. they are the farthest thing from a teddy bear.

 

[chilehed]

I did go to field camp in Montana, and a lot of that time spent in the field was alone in the Bitterroots.

Lucky you! I spent a week this past July just inside the edge of the Bitterroots, about an hour outside of Missoula. Spectacularly beautiful country.

 

[4ster]

Here's the entertaining story of "Old Ephraim", the last known grizzly bear in Utah. He purportedly was massive in size, standing 10' tall and weighing 1,100 pounds, and killed an incredibly large number of sheep during his existence. Have mountain biked by his grave in the Bear River Mountains many times.

The starting pitch of Grizzly (Olympic) Downhill at Snowbasin is called “Ephraims Face” & there is another called “3 Toes”.

In Tahoe there are hundreds of Black Bears around. An ever increasing population for the past 30 years that thrive on human leftovers & anything else they can dig up. They are relatively docile & only show aggression when cornered or threatened! I wouldn’t even consider carrying bear spray around there, a pot & pan to bang together would be as effective.

Bear encounters are almost a daily occurrence around my place. This little one was feasting on my clover & the tourists in the car were…
…being tourists


This guy was fattened up for winter & sniffing my buddy’s power bar.

 

[DanoT]

I have worked in logging camps where part of my job was taking a pickup truck full of garbage bags with the days garbage out to the dump after supper. The bears were waiting and quite impatient if I was late. Their favourites were ham bones and pancakes.