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crgildart

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My research shows an hour, not more
Is that for a full charge or for a 50% trickle (or whatever they are calling the quick charge) which only gets you another hour and a half of drive time? So, on a long trip it's drive 3 hours, stop an hour... drive 2 hours.. stop an hour... drive 2 hours, stop an hour...??

I know it's gotten better but didn't they have a contest between a Tesla and a Model T a few years ago to see which one could go 2,000 miles faster? IIRC it was pretty close..


http://www.caranddriver.com/feature...15-ford-model-t-race-of-the-centuries-feature

I believe e-cars will really be 100% solid when they can pull current directly from solar panel roadways and never really need to recharge at all. That will be amazing, and definitely doable pretty soon.
 
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@crgildart

I'm seeing about a 70 minute charge on a 100 battery model X which has a 350 mile range. Each model has battery pack size choices for differing range. It's all about how much battery do you want?
 

Don in Morrison

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I want enough battery to go 700 miles in 11 hours, followed by 600 miles in 9.5 hours the next day. Something I do every year.
 

crgildart

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I'm seeing about a 70 minute charge on a 100 battery model X which has a 350 mile range. Each model has battery pack size choices for differing range. It's all about how much battery do you want?

Looks like you'd actually need multiple chargers octopussed together to get that kind of charging speed. Good luck finding places to do that on a long road trip..
With a single charger connected to a 240-volt outlet, which Tesla recommends, the pace speeds up to 31 miles of range for each hour of charging, and a full 300-mile charge takes less than 9.5 hours.

Step up to twin chargers on the car and connect to a 240-volt, high-power wall charger (an extra-cost charging unit, not just a 240-volt line) and the charging speed zooms to 62 miles of range per hour, and the total charging time drops to under 4 hours, 45 minutes.

Really in a hurry? Stop at a Tesla Supercharger station and you can top off the tank with 300 miles of range in just an hour, as long as your Model S is configured with Supercharger capability If a Supercharger station is out of reach, most public charging stations can recharge the Model S at the rate of 22 miles of range per hour of charging.

https://www.cars.com/articles/2013/11/how-quickly-does-the-tesla-model-s-battery-charge/

Newer ones can probably charge faster, but even doubling that with one or two 240 outlets is still way longer than I'd lie to wait between fill ups on a road trip.

Add in the best battery is what, a $10K option? Also, from my R/C battery charging experiences, rapid charging greatly decreases the longevity of these batteries. So, we're greatly increasing our carbon footprints going in that direction at present when battery production and disposal post recycling is brought in to the equation right?
 

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@crgildart

TESLA has SuperCharging stations on most major roadways with can charge in the times I posted above. The smaller battery packs charge faster but of course have less range.

I sound like a TESLA employee, but I am not in any way affiliated, just interested in their technology and infrastructure. I do think it has promise. Yes I did buy stock... Yes I did lose a lot of money in said stock last week. :doh:
 

crgildart

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@crgildart

TESLA has SuperCharging stations on most major roadways with can charge in the times I posted above. The smaller battery packs charge faster but of course have less range.

I sound like a TESLA employee, but I am not in any way affiliated, just interested in their technology and infrastructure. I do think it has promise. Yes I did buy stock... Yes I did lose a lot of money in said stock last week. :doh:


What's the real story on the MPH caveats they post with their charge times and mileage estimates? Am I reading it right that for the full 300 miles you'd have to be going like 30 mph on average?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love a Tesla for an around town daily driver or short weekend trips. I'm just not having a lot of faith in how I'd gel with a 12 hour 800 mile trip in one. Adding another 2-3 hours of charging downtime to that really wrecks any incentive to pull a day trip that far in one.
 

TonyC

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Model 3 first 20 deliveries were last night. Specs finally unveiled here: https://electrek.co/2017/07/29/tesla-model-3-production-specs-revealed/

First drive by Motor Trend: http://www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2018/exclusive-tesla-model-3-first-drive-review/

The good news is that Model 3 will meet you pre-orderers' high expectations in performance and versatility. The $9,000 optional larger battery has 310 miles rated range and 0-60 in 5.1 seconds.

No specifics were mentioned about production schedule. I think they will take quite some time to ramp up and the preorders won't be done until early 2019. There are no AWD drive cars for now, though everyone expects them eventually. The earlier production cars will have the larger battery and likely some other options too. These cars will in general cost in the $50K range and be more than competitive with targets like the BMW 3-series.
 

TonyC

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Am I reading it right that for the full 300 miles you'd have to be going like 30 mph on average?
No, probably 60-65mph in 50+ degree temps and relatively level roads.

Typical supercharge times I have measured on my car are 135 rated miles in half an hour and 225 rated miles in an hour. Charging becomes very slow if you try to "top off" as I explained back on page 1 of this thread.

I want enough battery to go 700 miles in 11 hours, followed by 600 miles in 9.5 hours the next day. Something I do every year.
That scenario will take you ~30% more time for the forseeable future. One way trips up to 350 miles or so cost little in the way of inconvenience.
 

Philpug

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First, I really like what Tesla is doing but...I think there is some waste for the sake of being different. Like the gull ging doors and the full glass roofs. With either of these,, someone cannot put roof top carriers on. Seeing that I go though a windshield yearly out here, these cannot be inexpensive and I am sure the insurance company would get tired of paying for them. I will ask @TonyC, with seeing so many solar options out there now, could that rooftop real estate be better used for solar panels which could allow to charge while driving? It panels added another 20% range...I think that gould be useful. Again, I really like what Tesla is doing and I do see one as a viable option in the future but if my 8 hour drive to SLC turns into a 10 hour drive because of charging. it makes the choice tough for me...for now.

I think, if they can avoid glitches and deliver on time and have a parts network in place, the Model 3 will be a huge success for them. This is really fun watching a modern day Preston Tucker on the road to success.
 

fatbob

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I think, if they can avoid glitches and deliver on time and have a parts network in place, the Model 3 will be a huge success for them. This is really fun watching a modern day Preston Tucker on the road to success.

Hate spoilers but we know how that road to success ends.

I'm not knocking Tesla although I think some of the aspiration around what they will achieve is overblown. Model 3 is a huge step in the right direction but could be make or break if they can't maintain quality or get the infrastrhcture in place.
 

TonyC

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could that rooftop real estate be better used for solar panels which could allow to charge while driving? It panels added another 20% range..
Sorry to disillusion you, but in the 3+ hours it would take to use all of a Tesla's juice driving continuously, you might add 0.5% more range, and that would only be if the 3 hours of driving were in the middle of the day and it is sunny. This is based upon a quick and dirty estimate of what one of my 30 rooftop panels produces. I doubt any car has more rooftop surface area than one home solar panel.

I think nearly everyone would admit in retrospect that the falcon wing doors were not a good idea. If there is eventually a Model Y (smaller SUV), I'll bet it does not have them.

As for glass, obviously Elon is enamored with it, because all 3 Tesla models have a lot of it. As far as glass road damage is concerned, that tends to be mostly front facing windshields. Model 3 and Model S have big windshields but not that different from many modern cars. The Model X windshield is enormous, extends over the driver's head, and of course if you get a typical truck gravel crack in front, you would have to replace the whole thing.

Model S glass moonroof cars like mine do have slots to install a roof rack. Most Model S owners would try to avoid a roof rack as it would cut range. Skis fit just fine inside inside Model S, and should fit in Model 3 as it has rear fold down seats.

I think, if they can avoid glitches and deliver on time and have a parts network in place, the Model 3 will be a huge success for them.
I agree these are the keys.
1) Minimize the quality control problems of the early Model S and X cars. From all I read they have gone for as much simplicity in design this time.
2) With that order of magnitude volume increase, Tesla needs more service centers even if reliability is up to typical modern standards. It is NOT obvious to me that they are building enough of those. From a conceptual standpoint, electric cars rate to require far less maintenance than gas cars due to so few moving parts. I have a feeling Tesla thinks they don't need as big a service network relative to number of cars on the road as gas car companies.
3) Some slippage in the ramp up production timetable will be tolerated IMHO if the quality control is good. The slower it is, the more people will give up and cancel orders. But I personally think the greater damage to Tesla's reputation would come from producing a bunch of bad quality cars that either can't be fixed at all or would totally overwhelm the thin service center network attempting to fix after delivery.
 

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I saw a dude in a Model X today, he was sitting in a parking lot so I went over and looked in it and had him open the rear gullwing doors. Really cool. I liked it a LOT
 

TonyC

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I saw a dude in a Model X today, he was sitting in a parking lot so I went over and looked in it and had him open the rear gullwing doors. Really cool. I liked it a LOT
Tesla finally listened to their customers and is now offering second row fold down seats on Model X. The 6 passenger configuration with the pedestal second row seats does allow enough room for skis to fit between those two pedestal seats, but fold down definitely offers more versatility.
 
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DanoT

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Among the comments, this made me LOL:

Tesla, making coal great again.

Fortunately in B.C. before the previous government got voted out of power (pun intended) they started a massive hydro electric power project on the Peace River in northern B.C. Once you get your head wrapped around turning a valley into a huge man made lake, you get clean but expensive power that meets future needs no matter how many electric cars get built.
 

TonyC

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Needless to say I did not consider taking my Tesla to the eclipse. Common sense should inform owners of extreme examples like this to avoid.

The first production Model 3's will be RWD with the larger 310 mile battery and the Premium Upgrades Package (key items are better seats and upgraded sound system, but there are many more). With destination charge that's $50,200. Beyond that, autopilot is optional for all orders as the hardware is included and you pay for the software to activate it.

More info from Tesla website on Model 3 production priorities:
Which future options will be made available to order, and when?
We are planning to introduce the following options in the coming months:

Fall 2017: White interior option, standard configuration (non-Premium Upgrades)
November 2017: Standard Battery, $35,000 car
Spring 2018: Dual Motor All-Wheel Drive

Additional options will become available over time.

Not mentioned above is that the first orders are going to Tesla employees, then to current Tesla owners, then the people who ordered starting March 31, 2016. Within each of those groups orders will start on the West Coast and then move east. International orders will not start until late 2018 and right hand drive markets not until 2019.

The objective is for the Model 3 production rate to hit 5,000 per week by the start of 2018. The full $7,500 tax credit should be available to deliveries in the first half of 2018, half that credit in the second half of 2018 and a quarter credit in first half 2019.

 

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Choices.....

Affordable = Model 3

Style = Model S

Practical for me = Model X w/100 battery

If only money was not an object
 
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