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Slalom Ski Choice for Non-Racer

Sean

I don’t see any holes
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Mar 22, 2017
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I just picked up a pair of Salomon X-Drive 8.0. This thread had me thinking about an SL ski for groomer days with the kids. My Motive 95 isn't bad at this. But on really firm days (it was 5 F right after thanksgiving for example) I know I will have more fun on something narrower and shorter. Blister heaps lots of love on the X Drive (and they don't like skinny skis).

Anyway, I ski at N* and my kids are starting to like short jaunts through the trees on softer snow days, so I went for the Salomons (that and a killer deal). But yes, they are at least two levels removed from true SL skis.

I have the saloman xdrive 8.0 Ti's in a 177 with a 13ish radious and i love them! Theres a good ammount of power and rebound in them if you load them up properly and they love to carve tight fast turns as well as gs style longer turns and arcs. They're not the best in soft deeper snow or heavy crud but they excell on firm snow or even icy conditions if you keep the edges sharp. Even at 80 they carve realy well as long as you have high performance properly fit boots.
 

Carl Kuck

Ambassador of Stoke
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Del Mar
I have a pair of Head World Cup Rebels iSL RD (FIS) slalom skis, they're fun enough to spend the whole day cranking turns (at least from my perspective)... 165cm.
 

chris719

In the parking lot (formerly "At the base lodge")
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I have a pair of Head iSL non-RD (2016-2017) and I am not sure how the RD compares, but I don't think most people would need a stiffer ski. The plate for 2016 changed from the sad looking Speedflex 13 to something they are calling Race Plate Evo in the catalog. It almost looks like an RDX plate (same hole pattern and oblong hole mounting method I think), but the material may be lighter and it has a metal bridge connecting the two separate sections.
 

oldschoolskier

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Since this thread is revived, I'm going to share something that was shared with me a few years ago.

On SL skis the difference between cheaters and FIS race is predictability in how the ski performs. Ease of skiability (livelyness) is more controlled by brand characteristics and may vary year by year and is dependent on your aggression skiing, getting advice from someone that has access to try all is adviced here, calling ScotsSkier.

GS skis while similar, the true ease comes from a slightly more mellow requirement of performance in the cheater, again brand and year play in part here. Strength, nerve, aggression and training compensation.

The intermediate SL/GS lengths I refer to as Glolam skis, slightly long and larger radius than SL and shorter than GS cheaters. (Because IMHO there is really no such thing as an SL Cheater as it would have to be shorter and even tighter turning to help the poor mortal make to tight course).

The Glolam for some may be be the ideal high turn rate ski while still allowing a larger, higher speed turns in a safe manner, and as such are a general all purpose fun ski.
 

Atomicman

Out on the slopes
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Love my FIS Atomic Redster 165......so much damn fun. tuned to .7/4................just unreal!

More life than the Heads I have skied on. The Atomic IMHO has more pop, what I would call damp but more lively!
 
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dj61

Getting on the lift
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I love slalom skis on groomers. Have skied Head (iSL and Supershape), Stockli Laser SL (2015) and Rossignol (Radicals and Hero's). I would not recommend FIS ski's unless you are willing to work your butt of in every turn. For me the Rossignols are the most fun. You can drive them hard if you want to, but they let you have a more comfortable ride too.
 

François Pugh

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Found your post just now...

My stats, for reference: 1.82 m, 88 kg, level 7 skier.

A year ago, I went to the Hintertux Galcier, Austria, and demoed a bunch of slalom skis. I ranked them on a few distinctive properties. If ranked first in a category, the ski get 7 points, etc. I thinks it's all pretty clear. Here's the full list.

2aadiyu.jpg


I found the Fischer most versatile and I really liked how damp it is. I just couldn't properly bend the Nordica, that's why it's at the bottom.
Agree the Fischer RC4 Worldcup SC is the one to get. I have owned a pair for a few years and have a lot of milage on them, in all conditions except champagne powder.

I looks like you may have had a bad tune on the Rossi though; I traded with a fellow patroller for part of a morning, and the only thing I didn't like was the way the tip rocker interfered with turn-initiation and the lack of feedback feel with turn initiation. Your SCs probably didn't have the best edge tune either; a proper razor-sharp tip-to-tail 0.5, 3 gives me amazing grip on mine (when new they had a semi-sharp a 1:3).

I weigh about 150 lbs these days, but have weighed from 140 to as much as 180 lbs on the SCs. They will handle any speed you like; I've had them over 60 mph, but don't recommend going that speed on a 13-m sidecut ski.

Cons: Yes, it will make bigger turns, but the turns are not as sublime as making those same big turns on a ski with a big sidecut radius. At my current 150 lbs the CS is too stiff to be ideal in bumps, but still manageable. In over 6 inches of ungroomed (say they didn't groom a run and it snowed overnight, or it's a snow day), they require a lot of skill to manage; they keep trying to dial up a tighter turn than the snow platform will handle and you end up unexpectedly slipping sideways and catching. The solution is to either to be careful to not make tight turns in deep snow or deliberately over turn and know it's going to smear - still not the fun thing these skis were designed for. Similarly if you try going 40+ mph in deeper snow the skis will keep erratically hunting for turns - not fun, best get a gs radius ski for those conditions. At under 20 mph they resist going into a tight carved (railroad track) turn at my current weight. Seems to me they would be fine at your weight at low speeds.

Pros: Holds an edge despite incredible turn forces and hard surfaces (when tuned properly). Makes high g turns. Remains stable at any speed attainable on most ski hills, so if you can't resist the need for speed in a moment of weakness, you don't need to go swap skis. Quick edge to edge. Makes skiing groomers fun.

I would not go any smaller than 13 m, i.e. don't go for the 11-m radius head rebel slalom ski. At your weight the SC would give up a tiny bit to the SL, but at the cost of a more low speed limitations. It's more fun at low speeds to ski a ski that wants to bend into a turn than one that forces you to take on more effort.

P.S. About the small hills only thing. It's more a SL speed only thing (about less than 40 mph). If you're on a small hill you won't see much more than that most of the time, anyway, but if you're on a big hill, you may find yourself skiing faster and making bigger turns than SL skis were designed for. There are better skis for doing that.
 
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Cheizz

AKA Gigiski
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Since I made that list, I skied the Rossi again and simply love it. In the past year, they changed the binding system too, if I'm informed correctly.
 
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TS
MattD

MattD

aka Hobbes429
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Since I made that list, I skied the Rossi again and simply love it. In the past year, they changed the binding system too, if I'm informed correctly.

What model year was the Rossi you ended up loving? Still the Elite ST Ti? Would like to hear more about your impressions of that one. Several people have suggested it to me.
 

Cheizz

AKA Gigiski
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The last version I skied was the 2016-2017 ski. Not too beefy, tight turning, grippy as hell, smooth all the way, relatively easy to make bigger skidded turns as well. Love the flex and balance. Ideal for people NOT looking for something to chop logs, but foor folks that just want to carve smooth turns.
 
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MattD

MattD

aka Hobbes429
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The last version I skied was the 2016-2017 ski. Not too beefy, tight turning, grippy as hell, smooth all the way, relatively easy to make bigger skidded turns as well. Love the flex and balance. Ideal for people NOT looking for something to chop logs, but foor folks that just want to carve smooth turns.
Sounds great ... I have no race background, but looking to try out a slalom-type ski for Eastern hardpack. Looking for the best balance between the performance of slalom-type ski, with a little bit of versatility and "approachability" so you don't need to be in perfect form all the time to enjoy. Where would you rank this one today compared to the RC4 Worldcup SC, and what were your observed "cons" to each?

Appreciate your help!
 

dj61

Getting on the lift
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Since I made that list, I skied the Rossi again and simply love it. In the past year, they changed the binding system too, if I'm informed correctly.
Skis are identical but they changed the binding indeed.
 

dj61

Getting on the lift
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The last version I skied was the 2016-2017 ski. Not too beefy, tight turning, grippy as hell, smooth all the way, relatively easy to make bigger skidded turns as well. Love the flex and balance. Ideal for people NOT looking for something to chop logs, but foor folks that just want to carve smooth turns.
Very true. Great ski!
 

Cheizz

AKA Gigiski
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In terms of turn consistancy, grip, forgiveness the Rossi would score much higher with the new system binding. So it would probably come in second in that old list.

I own the Fischer and find it to be a bit more agressive/grabby than smoother models like the Rossi, or the new Elan SLX, or the Völkl Racetiger SL (not on the list, but that would be my top pick at the moment I think). I don't use SL skis much, so no reason to try and switch out my Fischers for the Völkl. But were such a ski become my primary hard snow ski, I would. The Völkl is both smooth and powerfull, and the moste versatile of the bunch (i.e. best in other things - bigger turns, straightlining flat passages, etc. - compared to all the others). And for more agressive skiers, there is a new PRO version of the Völkl too, with a very nice plate...
 

James

Out There
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This one is nice.
IMG_2090.JPG


15/16 Fis model. Not sure how current offering relates. Has a very nice flex.
I'll take the Fis versions anyday. Some even like the stiff versions for free skiing but I prefer more flex afaik. Would love tot try the Atomic.
If one is in Colo you might be able to try Croc slaloms which come in different flexes. Former Blizzard/Nordica designers.
https://www.crocsports.com/en/skis/race-skis/croc-slalom-worldcup-165-ski.html

Most of the "omg your legs will be ripped off" talk about these is just nonsense. I dislike gate deflectors on the tips for free skiing.
 
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MattD

MattD

aka Hobbes429
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In terms of turn consistancy, grip, forgiveness the Rossi would score much higher with the new system binding. So it would probably come in second in that old list.

For the Rossi Hero Elite ST Ti, is the binding interface the only change between the '16 and '17 models, or is there any difference in the ski itself? How much of a difference would there be in skiing feel/performance for a non-racer between the '16 model and the '17 model with the newer interface/binding?

Anyone with experience please chime in.
 
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MattD

MattD

aka Hobbes429
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Anyone interested in weighing in on 4 options? The relative price difference is listed as well for the skis I found ... cost/benefit analysis is always a part of the decision!

1.) '16 Rossi Hero Elite ST Ti (with the prior binding/interface)
2.) '16 Head WorldCup Rebels i.SL w/ freeflex Pro 11 for $150 more than option 1.
3.) '18 Rossi Hero Elite ST Ti (with updated binding interface) for $75 more than option 2., or $225 more than option 1.
or
4.) Blow off the whole idea of an SL ski, stick with the Laser AX I recently purchased for most Eastern days, add an SR95 and be done with it!
 

surfsnowgirl

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I've had my laser ax skis out on 2 very boiler plate days and that ski handled it so well I'm likely going to sell my redster xtis.

Are you thinking the SL skis will handle northeast ice better than the stockli?
 

François Pugh

Skiing the powder
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I've had my laser ax skis out on 2 very boiler plate days and that ski handled it so well I'm likely going to sell my redster xtis.

Are you thinking the SL skis will handle northeast ice better than the stockli?
It's not that SL skis handle ice better; it's how they handle, period.
Mazda Miata versus chevy Impala.
Suziki GSX-R 750 versus Honda CB1100X.
 

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